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Abstractors Aid In New Orleans' Recovery - Jarrod Clabaugh/OH
10/24/2005 10:19:12 AM (4176 views)
Re: Abstractors Aid In New Orleans' Recovery - Heather St. Amant/LA
11/14/2005 7:59:00 PM (4870 views)
Re: Abstractors Aid In New Orleans' Recovery - James "Lin" Toney/MS
11/14/2005 9:16:55 PM (4872 views)

Hey Kurt! - J Nisonger/CA
10/24/2005 12:06:20 AM (3124 views)
Re: Hey Kurt! - Kurt deVries/FL
10/24/2005 9:37:58 AM (5654 views)
Re: Hey Kurt! - J Nisonger/CA
10/25/2005 10:43:14 PM (5622 views)
Re: Hey Kurt! - Kurt deVries/FL
10/26/2005 9:31:29 AM (5667 views)

Whine, whine, whine... - Jay Duncan/MO
10/23/2005 10:43:57 PM (4307 views)
Re: Whine, whine, whine... - Jay Duncan/MO
10/23/2005 10:48:42 PM (5473 views)
Re: Whine, whine, whine... - Langdon Knight/MO
10/24/2005 1:26:33 AM (5399 views)
Re: Whine, whine, whine... - Deborah Manion/VA
10/24/2005 9:20:18 AM (5818 views)
Re: Whine, whine, whine... - Patrick Scott/IL
10/24/2005 11:23:40 AM (5756 views)
Re: Whine, whine, whine... - Scott Perry/PA
10/24/2005 9:33:41 PM (5783 views)
Re: Whine, whine, whine... - Patrick Scott/IL
10/24/2005 10:45:40 PM (5752 views)

Here we go again!! - Kurt deVries/FL
10/21/2005 3:38:08 PM (3280 views)
Re: Here we go again!! - Scott Perry/PA
10/21/2005 4:15:36 PM (5578 views)
Re: Here we go again!! - Kurt deVries/FL
10/21/2005 4:23:57 PM (5678 views)
Re: Here we go again!! - Kevin Ahern/CT
10/21/2005 4:54:04 PM (5930 views)
Re: Here we go again!! - Lisa Ramsey/TX
10/23/2005 3:54:46 PM (5938 views)

Code of Ethics - Jay Duncan/MO
10/21/2005 10:35:01 AM (4399 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Smitty Strickland/SC
10/21/2005 6:07:31 PM (5881 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Jay Duncan/MO
10/21/2005 6:23:54 PM (5875 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Scott Perry/PA
10/21/2005 7:14:44 PM (5791 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Douglas Gallant/OH
10/21/2005 9:38:21 PM (5662 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Smitty Strickland/SC
10/22/2005 8:06:58 AM (6006 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Scott Perry/PA
10/22/2005 10:35:54 AM (5987 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Jay Duncan/MO
10/22/2005 11:57:06 AM (5948 views)
Re: Code of Ethics - Scott Perry/PA
10/22/2005 12:01:35 PM (5885 views)




research time? - GORDON TINSLEY/CA
10/20/2005 4:54:52 AM (3463 views)
Re: research time? - Scott Perry/PA
10/20/2005 8:07:53 AM (6629 views)
Re: research time? - GORDON TINSLEY/CA
10/20/2005 12:44:12 PM (6613 views)
Re: research time? - Robert Franco/OH
10/20/2005 11:38:23 AM (7989 views)
Re: research time? - GORDON TINSLEY/CA
10/20/2005 1:04:37 PM (6618 views)
Re: research time? - Phyllis Agan/GA
10/28/2005 8:30:14 AM (6268 views)
Re: research time? - David Jenkins/PA
10/20/2005 12:13:25 PM (6446 views)
Re: research time? - Robert Franco/OH
10/20/2005 12:24:57 PM (6505 views)
Re: research time? - David Jenkins/PA
10/20/2005 1:08:11 PM (6500 views)
Re: research time? - Lisa Scherer/NJ
10/24/2005 11:04:35 PM (6268 views)

QUICK POLL - Scott Perry/PA
10/19/2005 9:55:01 PM (3551 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - James "Lin" Toney/MS
10/19/2005 11:29:36 PM (6187 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Robert Franco/OH
10/20/2005 12:24:37 AM (6168 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - NPC/GA
10/20/2005 7:03:23 AM (6250 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Rachel Malone/PA
10/20/2005 7:48:08 AM (6240 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Kim Cowles/WI
10/20/2005 8:29:16 AM (6188 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Deborah Manion/VA
10/20/2005 9:37:31 AM (6247 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Wanda Steudel/OH
10/20/2005 9:38:52 AM (5880 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Rebecca Barney/FL
10/20/2005 10:21:32 AM (6064 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Patrick Scott/IL
10/20/2005 10:37:13 AM (6149 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - John OConnor/IL
10/20/2005 10:43:36 AM (6123 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Kurt deVries/FL
10/20/2005 10:46:43 AM (6142 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Michaela Urban/OH
10/20/2005 10:55:00 AM (6120 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Kurt deVries/FL
10/20/2005 1:08:40 PM (6257 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Rebecca Barney/FL
10/20/2005 1:26:50 PM (5947 views)
THANKS, EVERYONE! - Scott Perry/PA
10/20/2005 5:22:43 PM (6047 views)
Re: THANKS, EVERYONE! - Robert Franco/OH
10/20/2005 5:51:06 PM (6034 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Wendi See/SC
10/20/2005 10:26:17 PM (6035 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Tammy Knight/MO
10/20/2005 11:37:10 PM (5786 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Scott Perry/PA
10/21/2005 7:20:16 AM (5721 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Jay Duncan/MO
10/21/2005 10:29:25 AM (7522 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Scott Perry/PA
10/21/2005 3:15:39 PM (5880 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Robert Franco/OH
10/21/2005 1:14:46 PM (5629 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - STEVE MEINECKE/VA
10/23/2005 12:02:03 AM (5863 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Kevin Ahern/CT
10/23/2005 6:30:34 AM (5765 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Anne Gilbert/VT
10/23/2005 1:55:15 PM (5914 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Kevin Ahern/CT
10/24/2005 6:42:19 AM (5669 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Donna Grady/NC
10/23/2005 9:31:18 PM (5749 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Phyllis Agan/GA
10/28/2005 8:45:42 AM (5751 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Jacqueline Quaresimo/PA
10/29/2005 3:55:31 PM (5257 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - ANDREW MOLLER/CT
10/23/2005 7:43:10 PM (5781 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Bill Jones/NJ
10/24/2005 7:06:57 PM (5773 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Anne Gilbert/VT
10/24/2005 8:33:51 PM (5663 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Scott Perry/PA
10/24/2005 9:32:09 PM (5428 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Lisa Scherer/NJ
10/24/2005 11:23:52 PM (5806 views)
Re: QUICK POLL - Scott Perry/PA
10/25/2005 6:11:22 PM (5762 views)

This has been bugging me . . . - Michaela Urban/OH
10/18/2005 9:57:44 AM (3562 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Robert Franco/OH
10/18/2005 10:44:27 AM (6062 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - John OConnor/IL
10/18/2005 12:21:30 PM (6036 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - David Bloys/TX
10/18/2005 7:02:55 PM (7630 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Scott Perry/PA
10/18/2005 7:48:12 PM (5934 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - David Bloys/TX
10/18/2005 10:06:16 PM (5893 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Scott Perry/PA
10/18/2005 11:16:17 PM (5926 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - David Bloys/TX
10/19/2005 8:15:48 AM (5986 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Patrick Scott/IL
10/19/2005 12:51:25 PM (7467 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - David Bloys/TX
10/20/2005 10:59:30 AM (5796 views)

Patrick,
Thank you for this well thought out post. In some ways you have clarified my thoughts.
On-line access hurts our business.  It allows a VM to bypass us on the simple work and only send us the work that they can't accomplish on their own
I agree. But not all VM's do this or accept it. Some VM's have come to realize that online access threatens their greatest asset. An asset they have spent years to develop, promote and expand. A VM's exclusive network of independent local abstractors is the greater benefit they offer their clients. Online records threaten the VM's as much as they threaten independent local abstractors.

VM's I have spoken with are as much against online publication of the records as I am and for the same reasons. Many have told their abstractors not to use online sources and some even put this mandate on their orders. Their reasons are not always stated but it is clear they do not want abstractors to use this "tool".

I"ve seen posts here on SOT indicating E&O is denied to those using online sources. The providers concern is the accuracy of the source which cannot be verified until it is too late. Online sites exclude themselves from any responsibilty for accuracy, timeliness or reliability. Statutes deny this disclaimer for the records held at the courthouse. Searching online is an error that may not be covered by your E&O.

But boycotting its available value while it's here is, I think, senseless
I haven't called for any boycott Patrick. Our clients,  E&O providers, and many legislators are.

I don't think, however, that lumping malevalent use of on-line records with legitimate use is productive.
I didn't lump them together Patrick. The Internet and those who publish the records online do. Some claim they separate them with passwords but it is a very ineffective separation. Choicepoint made this claim but it was laughably easy to circumvent. Even the most diligent password protection is nothing more than a padlock on a paper box. If it's on the Web it's available to every malevalent or legitimate user with a computer connection.

In some cases, on-line records are actually better than the official courthouse records.  One might be better off purchasing title plant records on-line than visiting a courthouse where the records are mismanaged and/or widely misposted.
This is also true. Only a local abstractor and the online company would know. Local abstractors can make this claim but they do so at their own risk if it is counter to the claim made in the online companies TOS or disclaimer. Your report cannot be more or less accurate than your source. If a claim is made, the abstractors report will be checked against the records at the courthouse.

Fact is, David, our fee for a current owner search in our home county is higher than yours is in your home county.
I'm not concerned about the fees you charge. You are not my competition Patrick. My fees are based on the time and difficulty of the search in any particular county and I am certain yours are too. You have no access to the courthouses in my area and only one county provides online access to some of it's records. You shouldn't concern yourself with my fees either. While I could provide my services in your area as both you and John have assured me the online records are even better than those offered at your local courthouse. I would consider it unethical on my part to invade your business via the Internet. You made this same assurance to the $25 abstractor looking for accurate online sources and to foreign outsource companies looking for more U.S. records to exploit. Both monitor this site and now they can reassure their clients of your endorsement.

If you want your voice to be heard by those who have the power to make changes that will benefit our industry, a unified voice is necessary. 
My voice is being heard Patrick by those who tell me they have the power to make changes. I consult with legislators, government officials, law enforcement agencies, reporters, and associations at local, state and federal levels. I assist them in their own investigations and provide them with information they need to protect their citizens. At first, I had to go to them but now many are coming to me. Last week I was contacted by two federal agencies, eleven county officials, two attorneys, and two technology firms. They learned about my efforts  from officials and legislators as far away as Michigan and Alaska. I think my voice is being heard by those who can and are affecting change.

I didn't take your comments personally Patrick. Well, actually I did take the complimentary ones personally. :) I want you and John to know also I meant no disrespect of your company. While I responded to Johns post, my reference to "naivity" and "blind greed" was not intended to be directed at him or you personally. The blind greed reference was intended for those who make the records available online for a profit and those who buy their way into your market through online access. Neither of these groups have any respect for your company.

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Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Patrick Scott/IL
10/20/2005 12:18:39 PM (5914 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - David Bloys/TX
10/20/2005 2:54:56 PM (5586 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Patrick Scott/IL
10/20/2005 7:15:04 PM (5697 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Robert Franco/OH
10/20/2005 12:30:26 PM (6042 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Scott Perry/PA
10/18/2005 5:34:20 PM (5890 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Kurt deVries/FL
10/19/2005 12:20:15 PM (5886 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Michaela Urban/OH
10/20/2005 10:48:49 AM (5848 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - David Bloys/TX
10/20/2005 11:13:59 AM (5833 views)
Re: Oh, One More Thing, David... - Patrick Scott/IL
10/24/2005 10:53:34 PM (5648 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - george Hubka/MI
10/27/2005 8:43:35 PM (5222 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Jeanne Mendes/CA
10/27/2005 1:50:55 AM (5622 views)
Re: This has been bugging me . . . - Kevin Ahern/CT
10/28/2005 8:53:09 AM (5606 views)

New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Kurt deVries/FL
10/17/2005 4:50:18 PM (3484 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Jay Duncan/MO
10/17/2005 5:20:20 PM (5621 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Scott Perry/PA
10/17/2005 6:03:20 PM (5335 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Iris Buchman/FL
10/17/2005 6:03:31 PM (5630 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Rachel Malone/PA
10/18/2005 8:08:51 AM (5829 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Scott Perry/PA
10/18/2005 5:05:08 PM (5709 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Rachel Malone/PA
10/19/2005 7:47:53 AM (5593 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Scott Perry/PA
10/19/2005 8:01:03 AM (5630 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Rachel Malone/PA
10/19/2005 8:05:39 AM (5798 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Kurt deVries/FL
10/19/2005 11:55:28 AM (5719 views)
Re: New member of Phoenix Document Service! - Tammy Knight/MO
10/19/2005 3:10:49 PM (5641 views)

LENDERS SERVICES DIRECT TULSA, OK - Becky Kale/IL
10/17/2005 2:22:31 PM (3445 views)
Re: LENDERS SERVICES DIRECT TULSA, OK - Iris Buchman/FL
10/17/2005 6:02:25 PM (5590 views)
Re: LENDERS SERVICES DIRECT TULSA, OK - Jason Sheppard/PA
10/30/2005 2:53:02 AM (5139 views)
Re: LENDERS SERVICES DIRECT TULSA, OK - Becky Kale/IL
11/8/2005 3:38:02 PM (5099 views)
Re: LENDERS SERVICES DIRECT TULSA, OK - Jason Sheppard/PA
11/21/2005 11:17:57 AM (4998 views)

Okay, another question. - Tammy Knight/MO
10/16/2005 10:18:06 PM (3260 views)
Re: Okay, another question. - Scott Perry/PA
10/16/2005 10:40:01 PM (5429 views)
Re: Okay, another question. - Kim Cowles/FL
10/17/2005 11:27:03 AM (5644 views)
Re: Okay, another question. - Bo Hope/AR
10/17/2005 6:25:38 PM (5689 views)
Re: Okay, another question. - Tammy Knight/MO
10/19/2005 3:13:32 PM (5678 views)

Fed up! - Spencer Kinsey/AR
10/15/2005 12:36:11 PM (3358 views)
Re: Fed up! - Kevin Ahern/CT
10/15/2005 5:48:16 PM (5218 views)
Re: Fed up! - Jay Duncan/MO
10/16/2005 4:30:53 PM (5234 views)
Re: Fed up! - Kevin Ahern/CT
10/16/2005 4:54:24 PM (5302 views)
Re: Fed up! - Jay Duncan/MO
10/17/2005 12:16:19 PM (5577 views)
Re: Fed up! - Kevin Ahern/CT
10/17/2005 3:56:17 PM (5539 views)

indexing - Douglas Gallant/OH
10/15/2005 12:31:46 PM (3139 views)
Re: indexing - Scott Perry/PA
10/15/2005 3:07:59 PM (5209 views)
Re: indexing - monica froese/ME
10/15/2005 6:40:24 PM (5073 views)
Re: indexing - Robert Franco/OH
10/15/2005 8:05:07 PM (5107 views)
Re: indexing - monica froese/ME
10/15/2005 11:18:03 PM (5077 views)
STUCK ON "STUPID" - Scott Perry/PA
10/16/2005 1:06:12 PM (5062 views)
Re: indexing - Larry Crooks/OH
10/17/2005 3:34:21 PM (5493 views)

Questions about VMC's - Donna Grady/NC
10/14/2005 10:32:19 PM (2626 views)

Anyone heard of this company.... - Loretta Reed/MD
10/14/2005 1:16:42 PM (3331 views)
Re: Anyone heard of this company.... - Kurt deVries/FL
10/19/2005 12:12:30 PM (5684 views)


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