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Rich's surgery - monica froese/ME
4/19/2005 7:06:15 PM (2397 views)
Re: Rich's surgery - Robert Franco/OH
4/19/2005 7:28:52 PM (3674 views)
Re: Rich's surgery - J.T. Shoemaker/NY
4/19/2005 9:10:56 PM (3611 views)
Re: Rich's surgery - Jarrod Clabaugh/OH
4/19/2005 10:15:25 PM (3554 views)
Re: Rich's surgery - Ellen Malloy/MO
4/20/2005 8:24:01 AM (3617 views)
Re: Rich's surgery - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/20/2005 9:00:20 AM (3617 views)
Re: Rich's surgery - Barbara Bennett/IN
4/20/2005 5:47:16 PM (3653 views)
Re: Rich's surgery - James "Lin" Toney/MS
4/20/2005 8:35:38 PM (3517 views)

Need your opinion please. - Larry Crooks/OH
4/19/2005 4:50:48 PM (2542 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Jay Duncan/MO
4/19/2005 5:24:28 PM (3756 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Larry Crooks/OH
4/19/2005 5:32:36 PM (3833 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 6:41:46 PM (3837 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Robert Breakell/CT
4/19/2005 6:49:34 PM (3779 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - David Bloys/TX
4/19/2005 8:37:10 PM (3834 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Robert Franco/OH
4/19/2005 8:47:28 PM (3891 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - J.T. Shoemaker/NY
4/19/2005 9:09:56 PM (3683 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 9:30:57 PM (3821 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Robert Franco/OH
4/19/2005 10:29:06 PM (3792 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Larry Crooks/OH
4/20/2005 7:28:24 AM (3860 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Larry Crooks/OH
4/20/2005 7:18:18 AM (3827 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/20/2005 8:58:25 AM (3777 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Larry Crooks/OH
4/20/2005 9:20:53 AM (3777 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/20/2005 10:34:47 AM (3795 views)
Re: Need your opinion please. - Barbara Bennett/IN
4/20/2005 5:46:20 PM (3724 views)

Hey Shannon.... - Loretta Reed/MD
4/19/2005 1:48:33 PM (2599 views)
Re: Hey Shannon.... - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/19/2005 10:49:43 PM (3868 views)
Re: Hey Shannon.... - Loretta Reed/MD
4/19/2005 11:18:06 PM (3839 views)
Re: Hey Shannon.... - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/19/2005 11:40:34 PM (3850 views)
Re: Hey Shannon.... - george Hubka/MI
4/20/2005 3:20:11 PM (3740 views)
Re: Hey Shannon.... - Loretta Reed/MD
4/20/2005 3:41:26 PM (3591 views)
Re: Hey Shannon.... - george Hubka/MI
4/20/2005 5:48:44 PM (3795 views)
Re: Hey Shannon.... - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/20/2005 6:08:46 PM (3629 views)

Countywide Abstract, Inc. - J.T. Shoemaker/NY
4/19/2005 12:46:38 PM (4087 views)
Re: Countywide Abstract, Inc. - Francine Miller/NY
5/23/2005 10:18:04 AM (3592 views)

notary blacklist? - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 6:21:17 AM (4634 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - J.T. Shoemaker/NY
4/19/2005 8:19:27 AM (4264 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 8:25:08 AM (4222 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Norean Cashwell/GA
4/19/2005 7:53:10 PM (4104 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 8:04:04 PM (4262 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - James "Lin" Toney/MS
4/19/2005 9:39:39 AM (4273 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 9:56:53 AM (4184 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/19/2005 10:29:23 AM (4104 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Judy Nisonger/CA
4/19/2005 11:17:53 AM (4246 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 1:57:14 PM (3982 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/19/2005 11:23:43 AM (4245 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - J.T. Shoemaker/NY
4/19/2005 12:37:16 PM (4149 views)
Re: notary blacklist? - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/19/2005 1:12:23 PM (4050 views)




Creating Business - Mark Sizemore/IN
4/18/2005 11:58:33 AM (2553 views)
Re: Creating Business - Jay Duncan/MO
4/18/2005 2:56:53 PM (4029 views)
Re: Creating Business - george Hubka/MI
4/18/2005 5:43:24 PM (3896 views)
Re: Creating Business - Loretta Reed/MD
4/18/2005 7:01:48 PM (3852 views)
Re: Creating Business - Jay Duncan/MO
4/18/2005 8:23:48 PM (3808 views)
Re: Creating Business - Loretta Reed/MD
4/18/2005 8:31:23 PM (3895 views)

Conference forum - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/17/2005 11:30:38 PM (2577 views)
Re: Conference forum - Robert Franco/OH
4/18/2005 10:31:17 AM (3815 views)

NNBS/Anytime Services - Becky Cantrall/NC
4/14/2005 8:00:46 PM (2788 views)
Re: NNBS/Anytime Services - Matt Pardue/KY
5/2/2005 9:58:39 PM (4003 views)

Anyone know about Stonewood Group? - SHARON YAHRAES/ID
4/14/2005 1:41:13 PM (2697 views)
Re: Anyone know about Stonewood Group? - Donna Grady/NC
4/14/2005 1:58:41 PM (3948 views)
Re: Anyone know about Stonewood Group? - george Hubka/MI
4/14/2005 3:15:20 PM (3848 views)
Re: Anyone know about Stonewood Group? - Becky Cantrall/NC
4/14/2005 7:55:23 PM (3860 views)
Re: Anyone know about Stonewood Group? - Rachel Crain/CA
4/21/2005 3:11:16 AM (3842 views)

Mortgage Verification - Sue/PA
4/13/2005 12:03:36 PM (2416 views)
Re: Mortgage Verification - george Hubka/MI
4/13/2005 1:20:12 PM (3975 views)
Re: Mortgage Verification - Tammy Harkay/OH
4/28/2005 9:48:48 PM (3694 views)
Re: Mortgage Verification - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/30/2005 12:13:50 AM (3825 views)

SECURED TITLE - PAM DESMARAIS/NC
4/13/2005 9:47:00 AM (2875 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/13/2005 10:34:03 AM (3673 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - george Hubka/MI
4/13/2005 1:25:00 PM (3640 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/13/2005 3:23:26 PM (3562 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Cathy Iffergan/TX
4/13/2005 10:16:54 PM (3522 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/14/2005 5:37:14 AM (3587 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Unida ukinclue/NC
4/14/2005 12:06:30 PM (3559 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Donna Grady/NC
4/14/2005 12:31:54 PM (3731 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - george Hubka/MI
4/14/2005 1:08:27 PM (3636 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Donna Grady/NC
4/14/2005 1:50:30 PM (3683 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Barbara Bennett/IN
4/14/2005 5:18:01 PM (3648 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - PAM DESMARAIS/NC
4/14/2005 11:37:40 PM (3514 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Unida ukinclue/NC
4/14/2005 7:29:28 PM (3659 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/14/2005 8:15:17 PM (3592 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Unida ukinclue/NC
4/14/2005 10:04:33 PM (3493 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/15/2005 6:54:15 AM (3707 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Unida ukinclue/NC
4/15/2005 8:18:35 PM (3535 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Robert Franco/OH
4/15/2005 8:50:55 PM (3473 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/16/2005 7:56:59 AM (3507 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/16/2005 7:50:31 AM (3640 views)

You are missing the point, but that does not surprise me. Let's talk about the real world as you choose to call it, rather than the fantasy land which you have described. Have you performed a closing recently?  It really helps if you can speak from practical experience.

In most closings the mortgage (DOT as it is known in your area) is executed in duplicate and sometimes in triplicate. There is a reason for this. There is a duplicate to replace a lost mortgage just as in the scenario that you have described. Pam's posting above indicates that she called her client, and was told that everything was alright. I assume from that statement that either she returned the mortgage which was at issue or that the title company had a duplicate original to record. In some state's making that statement without notication of a problem and resulting charges to her can constitute a waiver of claim against her for the penalty she was charged...at the very least it is a least a prior inconsistent statement impeaching the credibility of the claimant if the matter were to go to trial.

Based on the posting of Pam's client, I see several problems. The client indicated that it had made five attempts by telephone to contact her, and left five voice mail messages. Why would anyone send a document for recording to an abstractor that was obviously not available? Furthermore, the client should have indicated to UPS, FED EX or the U.S. Postal Service that the abstractor had to sign for the documents before they could be delivered. Otherwise they would be returned to the client. This is a common practice with title companies. Why was it not done in Pam's case? Good sense would dictate that the mortgage recording should have been reassigned to another abstractor rather than insisting on the services of an unavailable abstractor. At least that is the way it works in this area.

I also have difficulty with the amount of the penalty charged to her.The postings have not said whether the closing in question was a sale, refi of Heloc. A notary's witness closing fee for a refi or heloc is usually in the rage of $50.00. If you do not believe me, monitor some of the postings on the signing agent's boards, and you will see that most of them complain about not receiving a fee in excess of $50.00. This seems to be especially true in rural areas such as North Carolina (no offense intended to North Carolinians). The original cost of the notary's witness closing is an expense that would have been borne by the title company regardless of the recording problem, and should not be passed along to Pam. The cost of recording is also an expense that would have been borne by the title company, and should not be passed along to Pam. If there was no duplicate original of the mortgage, and a new mortgage had to be executed the notary's cost may even be less than a notary's full fee of $50.00 because the notary is witnessing only one document out of the entire loan package. It is not unusual for a signing service to request this, and they always find some notary willing to accept it. Of all the time spent in a closing, it only takes about 5 to 10 minutes to sign, notarize, witness and initial each page of a mortgage.  Consequently, I think the $100.00 charge to Pam was excessive. At the very least she is entitled to an itemized accounting of that for which she is being charged, and she should request it. Do you really think that is too much to ask?

With respect to the need for recording a mortgage, I have not minimized the importance thereof. The point you are missing is that because of its importance there are safety valves purposely built into the closing process to accomplish the recording and to avoid the picture of disaster that you have described.

In so far as any hostility that you may have perceived in my earlier postings, I would have to disagree with you. However, If I am wrong, it was probably a response to the arrogance, tone and colorful language contained in your earlier postings.



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Re: SECURED TITLE - george Hubka/MI
4/15/2005 8:09:52 AM (3527 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/15/2005 8:33:40 AM (3712 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - PAM DESMARAIS/NC
4/14/2005 11:24:25 PM (3540 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Unida ukinclue/NC
4/15/2005 12:28:21 PM (3621 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - John PAxton/NC
4/15/2005 3:41:51 PM (3529 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - PAM DESMARAIS/NC
4/15/2005 4:20:06 PM (3526 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - george Hubka/MI
4/15/2005 10:53:18 PM (3466 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/14/2005 8:02:09 PM (3527 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Unida ukinclue/NC
4/14/2005 10:07:38 PM (3544 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - PAM DESMARAIS/NC
4/14/2005 11:32:34 PM (3441 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - David Bloys/TX
4/15/2005 7:55:29 AM (3510 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - george Hubka/MI
4/15/2005 8:15:12 AM (3594 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - David Bloys/TX
4/15/2005 9:17:15 AM (3486 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Donna Grady/NC
4/14/2005 12:21:40 PM (3529 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - george Hubka/MI
4/14/2005 1:24:55 PM (3509 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/14/2005 2:38:47 PM (3311 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Douglas Gallant/OH
4/15/2005 6:09:55 PM (3318 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Unida ukinclue/NC
4/15/2005 8:24:35 PM (3374 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE - Douglas Gallant/OH
4/15/2005 11:05:41 PM (3422 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE...putting my 2 cents worth in - Loretta Reed/MD
4/16/2005 12:41:23 PM (3426 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE...putting my 2 cents worth in - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/16/2005 4:32:45 PM (3401 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE...putting my 2 cents worth in - Loretta Reed/MD
4/16/2005 4:57:08 PM (3286 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE...putting my 2 cents worth in - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/16/2005 5:06:08 PM (3418 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE...putting my 2 cents worth in - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/17/2005 11:01:18 PM (3210 views)
Re: SECURED TITLE...putting my 2 cents worth in - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/16/2005 5:03:59 PM (3387 views)

more unlocked articles - Kim Haase/MT
4/12/2005 11:41:55 PM (2439 views)
Re: more unlocked articles - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/13/2005 10:29:27 AM (3514 views)
Re: more unlocked articles - Kim Haase/MT
4/13/2005 10:35:35 AM (3449 views)
Re: more unlocked articles - Robert Franco/OH
4/13/2005 11:15:21 AM (3513 views)
Re: more unlocked articles - Kim Haase/MT
4/13/2005 11:51:21 AM (3635 views)
Re: more unlocked articles - Robert Franco/OH
4/13/2005 1:17:02 PM (3384 views)

Help for someone who wants to become a title abstractor - John Flanders/GA
4/11/2005 11:52:58 PM (2542 views)
Re: Help for someone who wants to become a title abstractor - Loretta Reed/MD
4/12/2005 8:38:23 AM (3738 views)
Re: Help for someone who wants to become a title abstractor - george Hubka/MI
4/12/2005 1:55:36 PM (3693 views)
Re: Help for someone who wants to become a title abstractor - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/12/2005 4:54:15 PM (3666 views)
Re: Help for someone who wants to become a title abstractor - george Hubka/MI
4/12/2005 10:45:43 PM (3788 views)
Re: Help for someone who wants to become a title abstractor - Kim Haase/MT
4/12/2005 1:10:20 PM (3561 views)

Cancellation policy... - Loretta Reed/MD
4/11/2005 7:31:15 PM (2577 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - george Hubka/MI
4/11/2005 7:36:16 PM (3706 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Jay Duncan/MO
4/11/2005 8:13:50 PM (3689 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - J.T. Shoemaker/NY
4/11/2005 11:21:59 PM (3611 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Shannon Blatt/VA
4/12/2005 1:46:12 AM (3618 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/12/2005 8:36:10 AM (3587 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/12/2005 7:29:01 PM (3676 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/12/2005 8:04:15 PM (3594 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - george Hubka/MI
4/12/2005 10:51:36 PM (3531 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/13/2005 10:39:02 AM (3548 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Bernie O'Hare/PA
4/12/2005 9:06:10 PM (3426 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Deborah Manion/VA
4/13/2005 8:53:08 AM (7486 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - Lisa Ramsey/TX
4/13/2005 10:41:22 AM (3627 views)
Re: Cancellation policy... - george Hubka/MI
4/13/2005 1:33:02 PM (3433 views)

CNBC Special on Real Estate Boom - Robert Franco/OH
4/11/2005 5:04:14 PM (2541 views)
Re: CNBC Special on Real Estate Boom - Mark Russomanno/NJ
4/11/2005 5:25:03 PM (3480 views)
Re: CNBC Special on Real Estate Boom - Robert Breakell/CT
4/11/2005 6:05:14 PM (3633 views)
Re: CNBC Special on Real Estate Boom - Kevin Ahern/CT
4/12/2005 8:18:26 AM (3453 views)
Re: CNBC Special on Real Estate Boom - Robert Franco/OH
4/12/2005 10:40:01 AM (3388 views)
I asked this same question on another forum - Susie/OH
4/13/2005 9:19:51 PM (3475 views)


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